Talk:Ms. Tybur
Like Pieck, I'm not sure she'd count as a villain. She is only defending her home. IMO, Eren is more villain in the Marley arc than either Pieck, Porco or her. --Grizzhly (talk) 13:11, February 12, 2018 (UTC) Agree with this one too. So far, she doesn't show any villainous trait. Admins must remove this and the Pieck article as well. If we keep them, we ought to add Eren and any other grey character from the series as well, because there's no way self-defence makes you a villain, yet murder of civilians doesn't. RandomDudeDude (talk) 13:42, February 12, 2018 (UTC) Honestly, it seems like it's a matter of a different point of view. There isn't really a good side and a bad side between the Eldians and the Marleyans. Eren Yeager can honestly be considered to be a villain at this point considering how he murdered someone and committed genocide. I think there's not really a character in this story that stands out as a pure villain. Even the major notable antagonists such as Reiner and Bertolt are only doing what they believe is right and for the greater good of their country. For now, I think maybe we should just wait and see where the story continues on with these characters. ShockwaveDude120 (talk) 16:18, February 12, 2018 (UTC) :Since we see the current chapters from the Marley perspective, they are basically our new protagonists/deuteragonists and I don't think that they are as controversial as Reiner, Bertholdt or Annie. I mean, a list of Ms. Tyburs villainous actions would basically be "fighting a murderous genocial invader" and "fighting for her own life". Also, she's not as fleshed out as other characters so that's basically all we know about her.--Grizzhly (talk) 17:29, February 12, 2018 (UTC) :I understand that, but she's only been in just two chapters, so she still needs more time to develop. Like I said, we should give it some more time before we come to the conclusion whether Ms. Tybur should be here or not. My only main reason for putting her here is that I'm looking at this from the Eldian perspective, in which she's an obstacle that's preventing Eren from ridding the Titans from this world. ShockwaveDude120 (talk) 00:14, February 13, 2018 (UTC) ::I agree that it is too early to come to a conclusion about her personality and character but, wouldn't the normal procedure be to not add her until she is proven villainous? And while in the Paradis perspective she might be a villain (depending on who you ask), the Paradis perspective also is heavily flawed with Eren being all but emotionally dead and Floche being ready to full-out annihilate every single civilian. ::And I'm still not sure on Pieck either (moving this here so that we don't have to switch discussions all the time). I don't think we can use what she might have done in a certain situation to say that she is a villain - she might also have done the exact opposite. I'm positive that Reiner and Berthold count because they actively decimated one third of Paradis' population and chose to do so on their own (that was never an order they were given / but on the other hand, they were brainwashed child soldiers) and Berthold all but loses it in the end and decides to actively keep fighting and wipe out everybody on Paradis - even his friends. Pieck, on the other hand, has never shown any hostile feeling against Eldians, we do not really know what she thinks about the Eldian's perspective in Marley. None of her character aspects show her to be a malicious or evil person and she is also not really much shown (only briefly in Shiganshina) as an antagonist to the protagonists because most of the time we see her we actually see her as a protagonist. I find nothing about her indicates villainy whatsoever, neither her character nor the narrative. --Grizzhly (talk) 01:28, February 13, 2018 (UTC) You can't just add prematurely characters and say "let's keep this until we find out if their are bad". It's supposed to be the other way around: find out a character is at least malicious enough to qualify and add it in here. For now the pages are forced. RandomDudeDude (talk) 06:47, February 13, 2018 (UTC) If a later chapter makes it clear they've done villainous actions we can always restore it but from the sound of this neither her nor Pieck have been confirmed any type of villains at this time based on the discussion. Jester of chaos (talk) 11:00, February 13, 2018 (UTC)